[390a]
though it be in different iron, still the instrument is as it should be, whether it be made here or in foreign lands, is it not?Hermogenes
Certainly.Socrates
On this basis, then, you will judge the law-giver, whether he be here or in a foreign land, so long as he gives to each thing the proper form of the name, in whatsoever syllables, to be no worse lawgiver, whether here or anywhere else, will you not?Hermogenes
Certainly. [390b] Socrates
Now who is likely to know whether the proper form of shuttle is embodied in any piece of wood? The carpenter who made it, or the weaver who is to use it ?Hermogenes
Probably the one who is to use it, Socrates.Socrates
Then who is to use the work of the lyre-maker? Is not he the man who would know best how to superintend the making of the lyre and would also know whether it is well made or not when it is finished?Hermogenes
Certainly.Socrates
Who is he?Hermogenes
The lyre-player.Socrates
And who would know best about the work of the ship-builder? [390c] Hermogenes
The navigator.Socrates
And who can best superintend the work of the lawgiver and judge of it when it is finished, both here and in foreign countries? The user, is it not?Hermogenes
Yes.Socrates
And is not this he who knows how to ask questions?Hermogenes
Certainly.Socrates
And the same one knows also how to make replies?Hermogenes
Yes.Socrates
And the man who knows how to ask and answer questions you call a dialectician?Hermogenes
Yes, that is what I call him. [390d] Socrates
The work of the carpenter, then, is to make a rudder under the supervision of the steersman, if he rudder is to be a good one.Hermogenes
Evidently.Socrates
And the work of the lawgiver, as it seems, is to make a name, with the dialectician as his supervisor, if names are to be well given.Hermogenes
True.Socrates
Then, Hermogenes, the giving of names can hardly be, as you imagine, a trifling matter, or a task for trifling or casual persons: and Cratylus is right in saying that names belong to things by nature [390e] and that not every one is an artisan of names, but only he who keeps in view the name which belongs by nature to each particular thing and is able to embody its form in the letters and syllables.Hermogenes
I do not know how to answer you, Socrates; nevertheless it is not easy to change my conviction suddenly.
Certainly.Socrates
On this basis, then, you will judge the law-giver, whether he be here or in a foreign land, so long as he gives to each thing the proper form of the name, in whatsoever syllables, to be no worse lawgiver, whether here or anywhere else, will you not?Hermogenes
Certainly. [390b] Socrates
Now who is likely to know whether the proper form of shuttle is embodied in any piece of wood? The carpenter who made it, or the weaver who is to use it ?Hermogenes
Probably the one who is to use it, Socrates.Socrates
Then who is to use the work of the lyre-maker? Is not he the man who would know best how to superintend the making of the lyre and would also know whether it is well made or not when it is finished?Hermogenes
Certainly.Socrates
Who is he?Hermogenes
The lyre-player.Socrates
And who would know best about the work of the ship-builder? [390c] Hermogenes
The navigator.Socrates
And who can best superintend the work of the lawgiver and judge of it when it is finished, both here and in foreign countries? The user, is it not?Hermogenes
Yes.Socrates
And is not this he who knows how to ask questions?Hermogenes
Certainly.Socrates
And the same one knows also how to make replies?Hermogenes
Yes.Socrates
And the man who knows how to ask and answer questions you call a dialectician?Hermogenes
Yes, that is what I call him. [390d] Socrates
The work of the carpenter, then, is to make a rudder under the supervision of the steersman, if he rudder is to be a good one.Hermogenes
Evidently.Socrates
And the work of the lawgiver, as it seems, is to make a name, with the dialectician as his supervisor, if names are to be well given.Hermogenes
True.Socrates
Then, Hermogenes, the giving of names can hardly be, as you imagine, a trifling matter, or a task for trifling or casual persons: and Cratylus is right in saying that names belong to things by nature [390e] and that not every one is an artisan of names, but only he who keeps in view the name which belongs by nature to each particular thing and is able to embody its form in the letters and syllables.Hermogenes
I do not know how to answer you, Socrates; nevertheless it is not easy to change my conviction suddenly.
